Sports Sedan Forum

Where is the Tony Ave Built 2010 Mustang delivered to Neil Bryson in Australia in April? Where is the Mustang campaigned by Brett Youlden now owned by Prahans fastest Plumber Bob Gill? Where is the Camaro of Geoff Mundays last driven by Terry Wyhoon? These and many more cars need to be campaigned. There is a surfeit of talented young drivers who would invite the opportunity to campaign these weapons. One only has to look at how James Sera with NO, THATS RIGHT NO Sedan racing experience is going in the Dean Randle Saab. Deans car is no doubt a good car but very basic with a live 9" rear end and a 6 speed Hollinger. I have running gear for two cars and am investigating a Dodge Viper Body from Mark Petch ( who assures me that he will be campaigning his Viper the last Pratt and Miller car built, to be driven by the Current NZ V8 touring car leader at Eastern Creek and Sandown. Maybe we need a franchise arrangement to add incentive for good fields? Perhaps lease arrangements could be investigated by keen potential participants for these under utilised and exciting cars. I dont have the answers but with the Economic Crisis in the US, running gear totally suitable for Sport Sedans can be purchased for less than $35K aus (Thats right engine gearbox and final drive with zero hours on them.) I invite comment !

Hey Mopar358 the Neil Bryson Mustang will be out very soon just had to make a few adjustments for himself to be comfy in the car. The Munday Camaro was for sale after it was involved in the big start line crash at sandown last year. Not too sure about the Gill mustang, thats one car i would love to see again, and also Bernie Gillons Jaguar i love that peice of work. I am really hoping this news about the Petch Viper is legit... Looks as though could be a good field for eastern creek if so.

Nadz44

The Randle SAAB is not a "basic" car. It is a highly engineered and developed racecar. James Sera is one of the fastest karters in the country and the step up to Sports Sedans is a similar jump as going to FF or F3. Just purchasing good equipment for a SS or even buying a fast SS doesn't mean you can be at the front. Look at the last generation K&A car (Prelude), by that reasoning it would be up there with the Audi. It still takes alot of budget and skill to be competetive in any formula.

But having said that you are correct with there being alot of cars out there, but not racing. I can't comment on this as mine is one of them.

Hi I wasnt by any means being disparaging about Deans Saab it is a great device, just without the complications of rocker arm independent suspension, Transaxle etc. The Prelude was the last car built by Elfin sports cars not K & A engineering. I am a Tassie boy and proud of its Tassie heritage. The car was built in SA but designed by Tony Edmondson for Greg Crick. James Sera is an exceptional talent who has been overlooked by the Major touring car teams(I know he tested for the Kelly brothers ) but perhaps Sport sedans can be a launching pad for young talent without the neccessary budget , $45K + per round for the Konica series. Do you think that the franchise suggestion has any merit? The utes certainley command big fields and support and the franchise and penalties for not fronting make it prohibitive to decide to not contest all the championship rounds. I am not suggesting making it as punitive as that, but it is an easier way to market the fantastic spectacle that good SS racing is, if we can maintain a 25 + car Field. With a number of old school cars that could campaign in the NA class the opportunity to tap into the love of Historic racing in Aus could be utilised. One only has to go to the Muscle Car masters or Historic Sandown and Phillip Island to see the potential for tapping into a large and increasing market.. Cheers

Can you explain how a franchise scheme would work? How would it effect people that only race in their home state and support the nationals when they come to town?
Leasing cars could be an interesting option for some car owners but I suppose it comes back to money, what people are prepared to pay to drive a fast and expensive car?

I'd think the cars are under utilised mainly because of a lack on finances. You'd know that the cars aren't cheap to run and trekking around half the country to race them is not cheap either. Most guys do it all out of their back pocket except for the few that have some form of sponsors but I wonder how much money that would amount to in the scheme of building and then running a competitive car.

I always thought it was a K&A car, there you go I am wrong again..... don't tell anyone.....

I agree with 2002. Having been state and national FF and also had friends in the ute series, I am not sure how it could work in SS. The problem with SS being a "launching pad" for carreers is the car speed is very different between the cars. People (mostly Dads) also aren't going to pay the big bucks for a leased or team car unless it can be up the front to get exposure. Then the snow ball starts because you need advertisement and TV for exposure, which costs more money. This will compound until SS is an isolated and very expensive category like the others...

From my experience, exposure and sponsership isn't always extra money for the teams. There is catering, marketing and apperances at other events etc that take money and time, sometimes leaving the car with the same amount of money to be spent on it!

The work that the SS bofins have done growing the class is working. The u3500NA class is an excellent idea trying to promote the smaller cars and there "race within a race". This class should grow in the future as the more modern engines suit this class and open is too expensive for most.

After all that rant, I do agree with you too. SS needs more exposure and cars, but the hard thing is retaining the existing crowd AND attracting a new crowd WHILST keeping the cost down. This is what I believe the new SS rules are creating as there are more new cars I have heard of in the build in the last year, than back in the previous old rules years I have been building my car!

Well, that's a lot of information to digest from the last few posts! First, I can say that no word has been received from Mark Petch about the EC or SD rounds. Maybe they are thinking of 2011? Yes, it's true that we have a lot of SS sitting in garages collecting dust. How you get them out onto the track is something that the SS manager's have discussed many times. There is no easy answer. The idea of a franchise has been discussed. We have tried reduced entry fees to encourage entries but with little success. It would seem that a franchise costing $$$$$? would be no more acceptable and thus would not add to entry numbers. With the introduction of heavy metal and u3500cc N/A rules this year, it is hoped that this provides a stepping stone for drivers of those cars and also maintains the value of their cars which might allow them to buy one of those cars that are sitting around in a shed. Having said all that, I can tell you that entries for EC are looking pretty good and are still trickeling in. We have to date about 12 confirmed. More on that at a later date when more info' is available. :D

The only thing that I can think of that is about to cost SS peeps more money is the new favourite tyres the open guys are using. The "floppy" 16in tyres that used to be popular are no match for corner speed of the 18in Le Mans style euro tyres. It will just add to the gap between level 1 SS (top 2 to 5 cars) and the other open cars a few seconds back.

But the future of SS i think will be the modern u3500NA cars that will continue to grow. Eventually you will have more newer cars in this class, and maybe even some of the open cars dropping down to save on costs?? Maybe this class should allow restricted turbo u3500 to IPRA / u2L Victorian engine rules too and be called u3500?

I think HM class is good to allow those cars to race, but i can't see new cars being built for HM class in the near future.

There is no doubt the heart and character of SS is the big thumping 6L cars, but the growth of the smaller cars and maybe a Level 1 / Level 2 classification in open will help with new comers to the class? You will never make any class essentially cheaper to race in because racers will always spend every dollar they can to go faster! All you can do is help to give racers a level they can afford to compete at.

My after work rant done. I going home to relax.

M

The only thing that I can think of that is about to cost SS peeps more money is the new favourite tyres the open guys are using. The "floppy" 16in tyres that used to be popular are no match for corner speed of the 18in Le Mans style euro tyres. It will just add to the gap between level 1 SS (top 2 to 5 cars) and the other open cars a few seconds back.
M

It is my understanding that the Pirelli 18s are no faster or actually slightly slower over the course of a lap in qualifying. From what I have been told by those running them, the advantage is greater consistency over a weekend. However, they may get faster once the cars are developed with these tyres.

Im Baaack. I agree with all the comments made by all posters. Re the franchise suggestion, i would not envisage it being very punitive, more an incentive to maintain good grids. And just as the Australian Super Sedan and Sprintcar World series have contracted drivers and then local drivers make up the field. Maybe a sliding scale, contest all rounds and a certain amount of towage could be paid per competitor, a lesser amount if a lesser number competed in. The NA class i see being a great opportunity to develop juniour competitors (not neccessarily young just less experienced or well funded) Perhaps make the class 4 litre and 6 cyl max which would allow all of the Jap and Aus current model engines but exclude BMW V8s or similar which would fit in the capacity but not within the spirit of the rules. A Transam type car is obviously the most cost effective way to build a Sport Sedan, Obviously it takes away from the glorious exploiting of the rules that the Hossack Audi and Bailey Aston Martin show (to say nothing of the carbon loveliness of Charlies Ex Crick Prelude) . A Transam style car could be configured with a maximum power to weight ratio (dyno Proven) for the NA class to keep costs down. That way someone using a 3.6 Quad Cam holden versus a 3.5 Quad cam Toyota could be weight adjusted to maintain parity. Perhaps other cost containment factors could be considered for brakes. Willwood calipers and a DBA rotor perhaps with a control brake pad. And rather than a situation where the saving on a bulk purchase is held by the franchising organisation, it is passed on to all competitors. No I am not a communist, but I dont see why one person or body should profit to the detriment of the competitors who are putting on the show. Hope this is topical and gets people talking and thinking (not neccessarily in that order) Cheers